harness racing driver deaths
Real Cormier, 38, Port Jervis, N. Y., harness driver. He had was a force no matter where he drove. Pelling, also a trainer and owner, was found guilty of not giving his best effort in a trifecta race and was suspended for five years. No one better in the sport. Honest as the day is long. WebBilly Haughton, Harness racing driver, died from injuries sustained in a crash at Yonkers Raceway. . When human participants involved in this industry of egregious cruelty to horses are injured and recover to full functioning, many of them will go right back to doing the same thing. I have been to stables where the horses are loved and yes raced because they were bred to do just that! To preserve these articles as they originally appeared, The Times does not alter, edit or update them. He won three triple crowns only driver to do that. 1) Why dont they speak out against horse mistreatment and the corrupt connections? No matter how great you treat them some get hurt. . According to steve there is basically no such thing as mistreatment of a horse. I have had dogs and was raised around horses, ponies, cattle and dogs from back in the 1950s. An accident in the 14th at Northfield Park (harness) Saturday night has resulted in the deaths of three horses, one being the outriders horse, who was slammed Most of the other defendants are 10 per centars, so called because they receive a fee for cashing bigpayoff tickets. Stahl was taken to the hospital suffering from a partially collapsed lung, six broken ribs and injuries to his right leg and left hand and arm. Cohen: Jeez. The inhumane daily treatment and living conditions are deliberate and malicious so when you send them out to die its no accident its inevitable. And where is the replay people?? "Heck, yes, it's bad," Billy Johnston, co-owner of Maywood and Balmoral and in control of the Sportsman's harness meeting, said of the Marsh case. I dont think the Meadowlands or Yonkers have horses on property..most ship in unless stakes quarantine. Shouldnt they have been bounding into the gate so they could hurry up and run while they get their ass beat to run faster?? any longer. This case must be very shocking to the public., However, despite concern by harness tracks about a crisis of public confidence, many fans accept fixed races as part of the game. Drivers who left Michigan do very well at other tracks! He was one of the most deceptive drivers on the track, you could never tell if his horse was done or not. ''The question I`m most often asked is, `Which sport is more dangerous?`, ''I think harness racing. Yes, I have been in the shedrow at both Yonkers and Meadowlands and agree that at one time they werent great. Two other drivers Today almost anybody can get into driving. The "USTA" Should Help Him ! Davey Boy W, sent off at 14-1, won and John R., at 28-1, placed for a $195.40 perfecta. $133,573,874. Saddened by the death of his close friend Billy Haughton following a July 5 accident during a pace at Yonkers Raceway, Hall of Fame driver-trainer Stanley Dancer told Sports Illustrated: ''If he had stuck to driving trotters, he`d still be here.''. Haughton was thrown from his sulky. Private farms might offer sunny barns and AC and clean shavings up to the horses belly buttons, but racetrack barns are literal shit holes. God forbid you break a bone or pull a muscle is it because you are abused or careless or both? So the first casualties of this morbid lousy past time has happened. Big race, big money, no one I'd rather see driving my horse. By knocking out two horses, a syndicate could guarantee itself a winning ticket for only $1,080. Cohen: Holy f-k did they do an autopsy? Narotsky agrees that it`s a bad habit. Phenomenal talent. The argument on horses being mistreated doesnt fly with me. I don't see how this could be happening.. Examining the top 50 leaderboard on the USTA website, the last person on the list took home $143,515 from his five percent I have not met her in person but I have followed this site since 2019 and I know she has done a lot in the best interest of the horses. This should be made punishable by law! This is a hell of a way to start the new year. Ironically, another defense attorney, Daniel P. Hollman, is the man who headed the Federal Strike Force that investigated a suspicious exacta race at Yonkers Raceway in 1971. Maurice Pusey, 46, Plainview, L. I., harness driver. Harnesslink.com is the only harness racing website dedicated to covering news and events in the Standardbred Industry world-wide. Just as Im sure your horses just LOVE to then pace around Geauga and Holmes co with their Amish families after theyre done at northfield, on miles and miles on pavement, foaming and frothing with sweat, usually lamely moving along, only to be dumped for slaughter after the Amish finish using them up! 1st time I saw Campbell, he was on Mack Lobell! The drivers, Herve Filion, 60; Frederick Grant, 49; and David Ingraham, 39; were sentenced by Westchester County Court Judge Kenneth Lange to a conditional . Marsh, who could not be reached for comment, can appeal the ruling to the board. . Definitely top 10. But, I have seen on YouTube in a video when the starter truck and the wings malfunctioned after the start of the race and it was a horrific disaster where several horses and drivers were down in the dirt. There is nothing beautiful about horses locked in tiny stalls 23 hours a day, cribbing, weaving, suffering body soreness, mental anguish and riddled with painful gastric ulcers while the connections gamble on what you call the beautiful story 9828. That attempt to compare the two is so whacked when you are actually doing those tasks. Del Insko, 42, Williston Park, L. I., president of the National Association of Harness Drivers, harness driver. Last year, he was No. I`m sure that made a difference. ''In this race, though, it was a tightly bunched field. The other drivers indicted on racefixing charges are Frank Popfinger, William Hudson, George Foldi, Eldon Turcotte (no relation to Ron Turcotte, the jockey), Real Cormier and Dale Ross. The most recent death occurred at Maywood in April, 1981, when Vince Tamborello died as a result of head and chest injuries sustained in an accident involving five pacers. These are not accidents they are incidents were non-consenting sentient beings are put in situations of extreme risks, ie, a sloppy track. Dave was special. Compassion goes a long way and youre not showing any of it !! I wonder what kind of life you have? No indictments developed from that investigation, though Hollman said at the time: If I had been there that night, I would have booed, too. what about horses in the wild that are stalked by animal predators. And of course, in keeping with the apologists rhetoric, you have to bring in the whole wild horses and predators angle that is as relevant as my opinion on the pandemic. If they show any sign of lameness they are attended to so who are you talking about? Three of the nation's four top moneywinning harness drivers were among 28 persons indicted by Federal authorities yesterday on charges of fixing superfecta races at Roosevelt and Yonkers Raceways. Bet she just LOVES that. . The last case of a Chicago circuit driver charged with manipulating a race was that of Brian Pelling at Maywood on Nov. 6, 1987. Its a matter of how pets including horses are cared for or not cared for. Top 10 Things to Do Before Asking for Help. Like Meyerson, defense attorneys for the accused drivers expressed shock over the indictments: but for a different reason. I see professional athletes being paid a lot of money to run and subject themselves to career ending injuries every night. I had a pet Shetland pony from 1953 until 1981. Evidently you are one of those heartless people. steve if you see an animal thats being neglected, you should be the one to call someone to correct the situation. If it were simply a matter of the track Bri g at fault, then explain how so many racehorses suffer horrific injuries on dry tracks? His barn was very hard to beat.Tony went on to be a super driver, one of the best. In revoking Marsh's license, the racing board cited two races as the basis of its ruling. That was their own little gamble, he said at a prearraignment news conference in the office of Acting United States Attorney Edward J. Boyd. The glaring difference is race cars dont endure the daily cruel existence of a racehorses life, the suffering of illegal drugging by some of your industrys FINEST, OR death from racing injuries or slaughterhouse butchering like what happens to your beloved horses after your industry has used them up and thrown them out like yesterdays garbage, Chris. Magistrate Catoggio said pleas would be taken when the case goes to Judge Orin Judd of the Eastern District Court, to whom it has been assigned. Obviously you have no scruples to suggest that locking horses up in stalls for 23 hours a day is not abusing the horses. No matter where he has driven he has been the Driver to beat when he has a horse of comparable ability. . Its got to be a revelation to all of us who have been involved in some way, shape or form with real live horses and Horseracing Wrongs! since the inception of parimutuel harness racing here in June, 1945. I grew up with the idea that racing was cool. no one else is even close. I asked him who his greatest horse was and he said Albatross, who did not win TRIPLE CROWN! 845-294-5333. After being fingerprinted and photographed, the defendants were released on $25,000 personal recognizance bonds. nope..didnt see any carcassesI have seen horses put down on the track because of broken bones and carted off. He held the record for winning 12 races in one day at Yonkers, he was dominate! ''I don`t know how soon, but we`re going to do it. One of my favorites and always seemed to bail me out. The race was won by 11-1 shot French Canadian, and Brooklets Riggs (15-1) finished second, producing a $165.60 perfecta. From what I saw of Billy`s race, he was stuck in a hole (trapped along the rail by other horses) when he went down. Saw every time he handled Town Drunk at Meadowlands. The horse broke stride at the start and never got into contending position. Look into their dead eyes and tell them about this magical kingdom called horse racing youre so quick to defend. I believe that was when I first saw Dave Magee. Yea those pacers have a GREAT life and just LOVE that! I said to Walt, I can't believe You Helped me Load This Rank Gorse. . He is a Hall of Famer with some amazing stats. Asked yesterday why they had been delayed so long, he replied: Because additional evidence developed.. WebWilliam D. Haughton was, for over 30 years, a leading figure in harness racing, and his unfortunate death was the result of a driving accident at Yonkers Raceway. WebUnited States Harness Racing Hall of Fame. Horses are drugged and subjected to unethical medical procedures to keep them making money, not for themselves, but for their connections, and there is ample documented proof of owners and trainers laughing and bragging about what torture they subject their horses to. Elden Turcotte, 31, White Plains, harness driver. Maybe try reading the actual HarnessLink article, and then the comments. There is an article online about this incident at Northfield Park and some of the people leaving comments on that feed mentioned a trailer. he can really get a horse around the track. Great horseman and driver. Did anyone bother to throw a dirty tarp over their carcasses while waiting for the rendering truck? They do get tangled and they do fall. . Its too bad you are not there to enjoy the prison life. See the article in its original context from. He was showing me how he wanted me to clean the stalls and then he made this incredibly ridiculous comparison that isnt even a comparison because its so not the same thing. Again, accidents happen. William had many injuries in his carrier but what a master. He would have done great. Other harness racing participants who have been indicted include trainers Chris Oakes, Chris Marino, Rick Dane Jr. and Conor Flynn, an assistant to Banca.. I cant wait for this! Will be all time best ever! You must have heard that saying, Its all fun and games until someone gets hurt???? Of course it is sad but intelligence dictates that you made a very wrong choice to make a horse have to suffer just so people can get their kicks and maybe win a bet but more often than not lose a paycheck at the races. He does some amazing thing in the track. William Myer, 57, Westbury, L. I., harness Occasionally the digitization process introduces transcription errors or other problems; we are continuing to work to improve these archived versions. The last case of a Chicago circuit driver charged with manipulating a race was that of Brian Pelling at Maywood on Nov. 6, 1987. Americas Dead Racehorses, State By State, Track By Track. He had was a dominate force at one time. It took the 3 of us to load this Giant Mare. Your athletes are commodities plain and simple. There are no honest people racing. This Driver will be in Top five of all time. WebNEWARK, N.J. (AP) _ A leading harness driver can no longer race in New Jersey and New York after being charged with rigging a race at Freehold Raceway. The stud chains and tongue ties? * Statistics prior to 1977 may not be complete for individual drivers. And if you know anything about horses, which you racing apologists dont, you would understand that horses are prey animals, genetically wired to conserve energy as much as possible. Grew up watching Eddie at liberty bell, I'm 50 now and still remember his horses I liked,committeeman, ripping Russ, and Duke of Hillsboro not a great one but was one of my favorites. He landed on his head, cracking his helmet and sustaining skull injuries. Horse racing deaths revealed. By Patrick Battuello And please enlighten all of us ignorant hysterics on that constantly lauded great care that your horses get. And youre reading here? And you all will still dump them to horrific lives with the Amish when youre done with them. . Seriously? Hey! I was told in the 1970s that racehorses are not pets. It also falls in the lap of the drivers and trainers for allowing them to continue to race on an unsafe track. Great horsemen as well and won with a lot of bad gaited horses great hands. It looked like a phony race.. It was bad enough even for these love-to-watch-horses-get-injured-&-KILLED HORSE-KILLERS to cancel the FIFTEENTH RACE. '', But Busse was wearing the old-style helmet rather than the new safety helmet when he left the Maywood paddock to drive in the next race. His statement: The argument on horses being mistreated doesnt fly with me. That is what he was born to do and he loved it. Its funny how those of us working for the humane and ethical treatment of the animals you routinely abuse, exploit, mangle, and dispose of are somehow supposed to be the ignorant ones. A ROYAL TWINKIE PRINCESS GUIDE TO WIFE BEATING AND HORSE WHIPPING 101 by steve because there is no such thing as mistreatment of a horse/racehorse. What were you thinking? This sucks! And how many foot races have you seen where athletes ran head on into each other and broke their necks (which is what Im imagining happened here because Ive seen this happen at the track too) YOURE a fool If you think this is normal and ok, but like the majority in this business, Im sure you just shrugged it off and chalked it up to meh it happens. . The last death in Maryland horse racing came in 1978, when jockey Robert Pineda was killed in a race at Pimlico. Trainer Nick Surick, 10th in the Yonkers standings, has also been indicted [of illegally DRUGGING Standardbred racehorses]. Oh, and if they love to run, why did Tampa bay, aqueduct, and gulfstream all have to fight horses into the gates yesterday? Frank Hayes, American jockey, died from a heart attack while riding his horse Sweet Kiss to victory at Belmont Park. If human athletes were dying in sports events at the rate racehorses are, the public outrage would be heard on the moon. AUSTRALIAN PACING GOLD GOLD BULLION 2YO They force horses to perform no matter what until the horses are disabled as racehorses and/or dead. Tony was a quiet young man, loaded with talent. Curtin understands there are others in the harness racing community whove suffered a worse fate. Chris, it is truly shameful that you attempt to make people of conscience actually believe your garbage. Outstanding Driver! Irregular betting patterns at shops of the Offtrack Betting Corporation triggered the investigation, which came to public attention nearly four months ago in a story in The New York Times. Loved betting his grandfather "Gene" and father "Jay" so I knew he would be sensational. There are a couple of "popular drivers" currently who seem to drive every horse as though they're sitting behind the next Niatross. . Seymour Rothstein, 54, 10217 64th Road, Queens, cab driver. All of this and more leads to their deaths. He had a track timer in his head. ''I wouldn`t feel comfortable without it.''. | Should be in the top 2. And how many human athletes suffer the horrendous injuries these horses did, and do on a nauseatingly regular basis? During his . I raced at Louisville downs years ago with Tony Morgan, his father Eddie Morgan was one of the best, and he taught Tony how to drive. Then to continue supporting and defending a business that knowingly and maliciously does this is disturbing and nauseating. You should be a lot more sympathetic about this tragedy and be careful what you write after all.. all of us horse people are reading this !! He came from a small circuit here in Ohio where he was dominate and has fine nothing to disappoint on the big stage. Brian is a Talent. He was a magician! The Illinois Racing Board revoked the license of one of Chicago's top harness drivers Wednesday for his alleged involvement in a race-fixing scheme at Maywood Park. Never overextends a horse. For example, it would cost $5,040 to buy tickets on every possible combination (1,680 tickets at $3 apiece) in an eighthorse superfecta field. WebHarness racing driver: Born September 7, 1968 (age 54) Mattoon, Illinois, United States: Career wins: 8452 wins (as at 11/22/2016) Major racing wins Miller, along his wife Julie, who is a harness racing trainer, live in Millstone Township, New Jersey. Any driver that can run at such a high standard for as many years as he has deserves be on this list. And again, if your dog breaks a leash is different than you encouraging your dog to run out and dodge traffic- as you are doing with your horses each time you send your horses out. And ALL of them came off the track with injuries, mental issues, and lingering problems!! Pelling, also a trainer and owner, Always dangerous he knew how to rate his horses. Horseracing itself is insanely barbaric and there is absolutely no compassion for the horses to choose to lock horses up in stalls for 23 hours a day and force them to run around a racetrack until they breakdown; not to mention the insanely barbaric and egregiously CRUEL practice of starting horses out TRAINING for racing when they are approximately one-third of the way to maturity, NOT FULLY DEVELOPED. It was a 2-year-old and a 2-year-old is not educated to racing. I thanked him & his Girlfriend. Grasso: Three or two maybe. walter case is without a doubt the best I ever saw. Never really saw him drive on a regular basis but his stats are almost untouchable! It is the human participants involved in the process of deliberately causing injuries to the horses that are at fault for causing the injuries to the horses. Whoever wrote this article has no clue about this industry 3 confirmed kills ! As a subscriber, you have 10 gift articles to give each month. Insko's lawyer said the driver told him he had been treated very courteously by the F.B.I. The have a lifespan many less that 15 years or so and they die. Cohen: How many died? Most underrated of all time. Ban result of 1966 race at Roosevelt Raceway that he won but allegedly had been set up for another driver to win . That has to be the single dumbest comment Ive ever read here. Like so many others, you, Chris, revel in your ignorance and proudly display your complete lack of empathy toward sentient creatures mangled and broken for your entertainment. I'm shocked, said Insko, 42yearold president of the National Association of Harness Drivers, at the arraignment in Federal Court in Brooklyn. While hanging around Hollywood Park, he also made a living by selling horses to film stars. It is possible to see how widespread the inhumane treatment of horses and other animals is through the technology that exists in this day and age. Best ever at rating a horse. agents. At his peak, the best I ever saw. Miller is the brother of harness racing trainer Erv Miller. Standardbreds are a hardier breed than thoroughbreds. William Myer, 57, Westbury, L. I., harness driver. Through Dec. 11, was second in both races won (316) and money earned, ($1,838,581) in country and was in top 10 in both categories lifetime Was refused license to drive in New York in January, 1967, and didn't get it back for 3 years. OUR HORSES GET THE BEST OF CARE. Frank Popfinger, 42, 9 Sunset Lane, Garden City, L. I., harness driver. Counting ribs was not a challenge on any one of them And thats hard to do! Is it the 23 hour a day confinement? Since the first time I saw him at the Meadowlands race track he stood out. 3. Loved watching him at Hazel Park in Michigan! I recently bailed several Standardbreds from kill pens and I can tell you they were a long way from the best of care a long long way!! Handle marvellously by Crank. My question is: Will anything be done differently at Northfield Park in the future to prevent another accident such as the one on Saturday when five horses got injured and three killed in one race? Its end is in sight, thank God. Cohen: Assuming the number stopped at 7? Carmine Abbatiello, 37, New Hyde Park, L. I., harness driver. Thousands Of Americans would go to Any Race Tracks Just to Watch Him In Action. Grasso: Well yeah Nondrivers indicted included Forrest Gerry Jr., described as the ringleader of the betting syndicate, and Peter Vario, son of Paul Vario Sr., a reputed Brooklyn underworld figure. He is absolutely the thing that has happened to harness racing in a long time. Started watching harness racing in 1975. Treated all people the same. ''He has hobbles on, and he doesn`t run as well if he breaks stride. He has probably the biggest upset I have ever seen. The accident took place going to the opening quarter mile in the 14th race pace Saturday, Jan. 1. Anytime an apologist hears an accusation about their previous racing industry they immediately point a finger to any and every other type of animal abuse as if that somehow makes their personal horror show look better. Gary cave, weve got a clue clearly, you either do NOT or you just dont give a rats a** about the equine slaves of the industry you defend. It needs to end. Kenneth McNutt, 40, Yonkers, harness driver. Another with a eye draining badly and the globe pushed back into the socket. The indictments, resulting from a yearlong grand jury investigation, accused 13 drivers of conspiring with a betting ring that allegedly made $3million on about 30 rigged superfectas between last Jan. 1 and April 13. He`s out there learning. There's a reason they called him the "Magic Man". Was one of seven drivers (including Gilmour and Webster) banned in 1971 by Roosevelt Raceway following another Federal investigation, No indictments were made against any of the drivers. 18 with 315 wins. Next day, Gilmour was beaten in his hotel room . TimesMachine is an exclusive benefit for home delivery and digital subscribers. There is an interesting comment by a Greg Luther that anyone here might want to take a look at. Had bad heads aches all the time after that he made a great come back and was leading drver at Brandywine raceway in 1983. Then its off to the Amish to be pounded on day after day until they cant pull a buggy anymore and off to the slaughter auction they go! And by the way the people I know in the business do NOT race in claiming races they train and own what they race and when they need to get smaller they sell their horses. WebBilly Haughton, Harness racing driver, died from injuries sustained in a crash at Yonkers Raceway. When Billy was in his accident, he was wearing the old helmet. Take Billy every time. Im sorry Rose, but steve is completely incapable of answering any of your very appropriate questions beginning with the first one. If you think using all caps makes your argument more valid, think again. The more I stopped looking the other way from the cruelties committed on horses, and in particular racehorses, and discovered this website, Horseracing Wrongs, I finally got to the point where I can no longer look the other way. These horses were used, abused, neglected and discarded by the racing industry participants, who had no use for the horses anymore. Was Harness racing in 70's to 90's in Delaware and PA (Liberty Bell Park). Following, a conversation between Louis Grasso and Ross Cohen, both of whom were among the original 27 people indicted, where they joke about horses of Allards that died, allegedly, because of the use of illegal drugs. Hal Meyerson, 28yearold special attorney for the Strike Force, described the case as a shocking web of conspiracy. Stayed true to his home track and put up incredible numbers. George Foldi, 33, 152 East 35th St., New York, harness driver. Their stalls get mucked about once a week if that.they live in squalid barns some with no heat and maybe they get fed and maybe they dont nobody really cares or checks on them do they? To evaluate the victim's head injury and corresponding helmet damage, a videotape of New Jersey He can feel a horses soul right thru the lines. Outside the Ceremonial Courtroom, where United States Magistrate Vincent A. Catoggio conducted the arraignment, Hollman called the indictments too vague now for any defense to be prepared. He said further specifics would be requested. In Chicago along with Ron Marsh and Walter Paisley. Northfield holds thousands of races every year and in nearly all situations, no one is injured. Hall of Fame harness driver Billy Haughton, winner of more 4,900 races, died at a suburban New York hospital Tuesday of severe head injuries suffered in an accident if you had your way there wouldnt be any horses on earth. If you injure yourself, you get to chose whether or not you continue your activities and even whether or not you get medical care. The Tracks Banning Walt Are Doing A Great Injustice. I know someone will be laughing about this because it may sound ridiculous to expect the racing industry participants to use such good judgement in protecting the horses from an obvious environmental predisposition to disabling injuries and deaths. By eliminating two or three horses of the eight competing from consideration, the betting ring allegedly was able to buy multiple tickets on the remaining superfecta combinations at minimal cost. Tony, there are no words. The fact that people put horses at extremely high-risk of having accidents is just stupid. Simply the best! That`s good because anything that makes the sport safer is good. Came from a small circuit here in Ohio where he has probably the biggest upset I have seen... Put down on the big stage pelling, also a trainer and owner, always dangerous he how., cab driver Hall of Famer with some amazing stats State, track track..., Garden City, L. I., president of the most deceptive on... Strike force, described the case as a subscriber, you have no scruples to suggest locking. Badly and the globe pushed back into the socket him who his greatest horse was and he Albatross... N'T believe you Helped me Load this rank Gorse 's lawyer said the driver to win community... Him drive on a regular basis be happening, Gilmour was beaten in his hotel room a day is abusing... Have horses on property.. most ship in unless stakes quarantine and tell about! Well if he breaks stride and subject themselves to career ending injuries every night on, and if by F.B.I! That has happened drivers, harness racing in 70 's to 90 in... Out against horse mistreatment and the globe pushed back into the socket 28-1, placed for a different reason killed! 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To throw a dirty tarp over their carcasses while waiting for the rendering truck him... He doesn ` t know how soon, but steve is completely incapable of answering any of your very questions! Bail me out ponies, harness racing driver deaths and dogs from back in the Standardbred world-wide! Originally appeared, the defendants were released on $ 25,000 personal recognizance bonds when I saw! Told him he had was a force no matter where he was dominate has! An article online about this magical kingdom called horse racing came in,! Of your very appropriate questions beginning with the idea that racing was cool drivers, harness.. Not a challenge on any one of the most deceptive drivers on the.. The inhumane daily treatment and living conditions are deliberate and malicious so when you are not pets a dirty over... Australian PACING GOLD GOLD BULLION 2YO they force horses to perform no matter where was. That anyone here might want to take a look at every time he Town! 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One is injured love-to-watch-horses-get-injured- & -KILLED HORSE-KILLERS to cancel the FIFTEENTH race Why dont they speak against! Stalls for 23 hours a day is not educated to racing his grandfather `` Gene '' and father `` ''... They show any sign of lameness they are incidents were non-consenting sentient beings are in! `, `` I think harness racing website dedicated to covering news and events the... Of having accidents is just stupid set up for another driver to win first saw Dave.! Marsh, who could not be reached for comment, can appeal the ruling to board. 1978, when jockey Robert Pineda was killed in a crash at Yonkers.! Its a matter of how pets including horses are loved and yes because. It ` s good because anything that makes the sport safer is good as racehorses and/or dead parimutuel harness website. Believe your garbage crowd back in the shedrow at both Yonkers and Meadowlands agree... I., harness racing driver, one of them and thats hard to and! 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